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 Post subject: Cause for concern the offense can't score consistently
PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:48 pm 
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I know we are all excited about the big win last night but there is cause for concern with the offense.The offense did not score after the first quarter this without one of the Eagles top defensive players Trotter. Remembering last year the same thing happened to the offense where they would go quarters in a game,alot of 3 and outs yet barely pulling the game out.We talk about how good the eagles defense is New England scored 21 on them in the super bowl with trotter.When the falcon's play new england that will be another watermark at least for me.New England has put away both a quality eagles and carolina team in the super bowl.It is home field plus the patriot's lost there coordinators. Getting back to the main point when is the offense going to consistently score with out a buinch of 3 and outs.True the falcon's are winning but mostly because of a good defense.How long can the defense continue to hold up this team?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:42 pm 
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it has been the M.O. of the offense so far under knapp. score in bunches (and when they do drive down the field and score it usually looks effortless, like we can dominate the team the entire game but then the 123 and outs all of the sudden) and then sit on the lead. dirtybird said it in another thread, how knapp's calls are very predictable and it's true. and it's pretty bad when fan's can guess what's gonna be called. also the extreme conservative play calling in the second half, kind of playing not to lose once we get the lead in the first half. i'm sure the opposing team is making adjustments but it happens almost every single freaking game. i wonder if he did the same thing in san fran?


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 Post subject: Another thing I failed t mention
PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:56 pm 
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The 2 minute offense stinks.The Falcon';s have not learned how to put pressure on an opponnet and break there backs! Mishandling the play clock with 4 seconds to go .The falcons had 10 seconds to do something and the offense just looked around and blew 6 seconds.Mora,you got to get your 2 minute offense to the point other teams pay and not sit on a lead.sitting on a lead will only give the other team ammunition to come back on you.You have to break there morale(other team).I really don't think if the falcon's were down 14 points with 2 minutes to go the offense could come back against a quality team.To be in the elite class remember the 49ers of steve young,montana,new england,colts,elway the common thread is they can pass the ball,work the sidelines which vick can't do.He can't hit open receviers on the field how is he goign to thread consistently sideline patterns?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:26 pm 
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I didn't see too many open receivers last night. They kept covering Crump with Dawkins or doubling him, and the receivers seemed to have a DB on their hip most of the time Vick did throw to them. I'm not saying Vick played tremendously, but he is doing what he can with what he's got to work with. That pass to Jenkins was huge though, and something to build upon.


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 Post subject: Beating good teams also shows strengths and weaknesses
PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:38 pm 
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I don't have a tape of the game but there were a few times Vick simply missed the man completely.I know the running backs were supposed to be blocking the blitz but again a few times where vick was running for his life.Where are the backs in the passing game to dump the ball to? Get up field,run a 5 yd route and stop,cut to the right left.Make the defender wonder what your doing.I don't see that again vick was running from the defenders a few times and the backs where were they. Last night's game showed me that despite what we are hearing from training camp the passing game really has not improved.Maybe it is propaganda to make other teams think we can pass but after awhile teams will blitz without hesitation knowing that we have no passing game.Take away the bomb to jenkins and vick has a vick passing game.We win that is all that counts but if Michael expects to last more than 5 more years since he will eventually slow down and not have his incredible speed he better learn to throw the ball.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:56 pm 
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While I agree that Vick made alot of bad throws, which all were high btw, and he tended to force things at times we shouldnt jump the gun against a mediocre performance vs. the eagles. Are you underrating the eagles defense? A secondary that sent 3 out of 4 starters to the probowl? Dawkins in the best FS in the league and is the 2nd best safety next to Reed. Philly had pressure on our QB all night long. They blitzed at will and at times we could do nothing.

Vick showed alot by sitting in the pocket well all night. He had 4 carries in 3 quarters and two of those were designed runs. He is gaining confidence in our passing game but still relies on Crump too much. We will have to see how he does vs. Seattle.


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 Post subject: Your right vick has a long way to go!
PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:10 pm 
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I know the Philly defense is one of the best in the league but i would have hoped with another training camp,one more off season of familiarity that vick couold have shown a little more ability in the passing game.He had 156 yards but has got to improve to beat all top contenders consistently.I think the problem with the falcon's is they are lulled into the fact that there defense will carry them all the time and vick will be vick just running to win games.That will work for now but short and long term Vick needs to complete passes.Stagnation is becoming to common for the offense it scores 14-21 points and then shutsdown.The first half of the schedule we will see if Vick and the offense has grasped anything under knapp's system! Meanwhile I hope to see progress by the end of the first half of the schedule.One year and off season should be some time to figure out a half way quality passing game.Will see I am not going to keep jumping on the falcon's.I am happy for the win!


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:17 pm 
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Last night was a combination of a great secondary facing a developing quarterback. Of course Vick made plenty of mistakes but a lot were forced by Philly (or I'd like to believe). This is the last year we can say "Vick has a lot to learn" because he should be getting there by now.

Also... One thing can said about Dan Reeves. Mike Vick was the golden boy of the 2-minute drill under Dan's offense. I remember how many great 2-minute drives we had at the end of the half and game when Reeves was coach. Of course that was the only good thing we can remember Post-1998.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2005 12:26 pm 
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There was a total switchover in Knapp's playcalling from one half to the next. I remember thinking midway through the 2nd quarter how good a game Knapp had called so far. Then the team totally got conservative in the 2nd half, which kept the Eagles in the game.

Knapp was known for his conservative style in San Fran too, and most 49er fans I talked to after he left were more than happy to see him go (but then again those same fans thought Rattay, Barlow, and Lynch would be every just as good as Garcia, Hearst, and Owens).

I've been a Knapp defender for much of his tenure here, but I recognized the other night how spotty he is as a play-caller. He's just as inconsistent as Vick is as a passer. There may be a series or two in which he looks brilliant, and then others in which you're calling for a change.

I'm going to heap the offensive shortcomings of the 2nd half on two people, and only two people: Vick and Knapp. I don't know who is more to blame. Vick did miss on some throws, but there were plenty of times that Knapp made a weak call. They worked hand in hand to dismantle the potency of the Falcon offense on Monday night.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2005 2:23 pm 
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I definitely have some concerns and questions about our offense, and an observation I've not heard anyone make.

First, is Vick allowed to audible to any play he wants at anytime?

Second, Vick is too focused on throwing to Crumpler & really needs to throw to Dunn & Griffith much more, as someone mentioned before. Everyone knows about Crumpler & I guarantee people are not too concerned with Dunn in our passing game, which is a huge mistake because he may be our most dangerous receiver right now...if we use him.

Also, the observation is that no receiver has ever caught a 5 yard out or hook and then broke the play for a 50+yd TD since Vick has been here. I think when someone does this it will convince Vick to start looking to the WR's more often, if this ever happens.

Either way he is going to have to get his high throws down, because that is very scary & will lead to 3, 4, & 5 INT games. I don't remember Vick throwing so many high balls when he was playing for Reeves and it makes me wonder if the pressure of being expected to win has got into his head some.

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 Post subject: We should start seeing marked improvement
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2005 8:05 pm 
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OK the Eagle's have a great defense which would have been better with trotter.However the teams that are not so good in defense like Seattle vick needs to show improvement.I would like to see a healthy roddy white maybe he is the guy that can be the no1 receiver we need.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2005 9:04 pm 
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I think the true test of how far our passing game has come will be the next few games. Vick needs to throw to the backs more definitely. I'm not saying Madden is anything like the real deal, but I've seen Dunn in the open field enough to know he could do what Westbrook was doing to us Monday night. Again, if we can't manage to throw the ball downfield against a couple of the next few teams then I will definitely be getting worried about Vick as a passer. Call me Mr. Optimistic but I think the next 3 years will be when Vick really grows as a passer. Still, only time will tell but I will back Vick until the end if only because we actually win when he plays.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2005 12:14 pm 
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Too bad that three years in the NFL is an eternity and the window could be shutting on us by then (top star players getting old and the possibility that we can't keep a high level of personnel flowing in). Granted I doubt this is the case especially with McKay as GM. However, he is candidate to become the leagues new GM and this is something he won't pass on. If McKay leaves and no one learned enough from him to be quality we could be in deep crap again.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2005 1:52 pm 
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Well luckily for us, I think Tags just signed a 3-year extension, so I don't think McKay is going anywhere until 2008 at the earliest.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:31 am 
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Actually, every pass was thrown to a guy that was somewhat open. The breakdown ended up being 10 bad passes (includes INT which was simply thrown too soft). He was really all over the place.

The good news: He made the right reads.

I agree on the 2 minute offense concerns especially at the end of the first half.

Last year, defenses made their adjustments and because of the new system, I think Vick had some trouble reading those. This first game, the problem was simply being erratic. The latter is easily fixed.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 6:50 pm 
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And being erratic could come from being on his first MNF game. Again, he put up almost the exact same numbers as Elway did in his first MNF game....and Vick did it against the best defense in his conference.

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 Post subject: It is easy to rip vick for only the first game
PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 6:59 pm 
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Michael has a chance to prove the skeptics wrong this weekend vs the Seahawks.The next week it is buffalo which will be tough to beat in buffalo.The Minnesota game Michael should pass well then comes the boys of the Patriot's. It is easy to criticize michael but it is only one game.It can easily be changed about his passing ability so I hope he gets on track.Dump the ball to the running back,use your receivers,screen pass.I get tired of the same run run pass plays.Knapp is not very inovative.If Roddy is unable to play sme other receivers need to step up.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 5:00 pm 
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I haven't read this entire thread....

Seattle's gameplan was to stop the run and they did exactly that. Nice gameplan.

However, since we were unable to run the ball we only threw it five times in the first half!! This I simply cannot understand. :?

Are we afraid to go downfield????


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 6:05 pm 
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DenimJacket wrote:
I haven't read this entire thread....

Seattle's gameplan was to stop the run and they did exactly that. Nice gameplan.

However, since we were unable to run the ball we only threw it five times in the first half!! This I simply cannot understand. :?

Are we afraid to go downfield????


Yes. And noone outside of the Falcons knows why. Is it Knapp being overly conservative, trying to get Vick to develop a short game in order to support the run? Or is it Mora not trusting Vicks accuracy? Or is it Vick himself, not having the experience to see downfield and panic throwing to a short man or tucking and running to avoid the blitz?

We may not know unless there is a blowup by someone involved who then spills the beans on their inner workings.


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