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 Post subject: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 10:11 am 
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I, like Cryil am a long time suffering Falcons fan. Unlike Cryil, I do believe that the lean years are gone and good days are ahead for the franchise. We are experiencing it now. We've played 48 seasons and I broke them down record wise in 8 year increments.....we are trending up. 8-)

1966-1973: 38-69-4 Win% .355 0 Playoff appearances
1974-1981: 52-68-0 Win% .433 2 Playoff appearances
1982-1989: 38-81-1 Win% .316 1 Playoff appearance
1990-1997: 53-75-0 Win% .414 2 Playoff appearances
1998-2005: 63-64-1 Win% .492 3 Playoff appearances
2006-2013: 71-57-0 Win% .554 4 Playoff appearances


Despite popular belief, the franchise has come along ways.....


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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 10:37 am 
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Panthers take the Pats to the wire, in

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which is famous for this

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we get there, and get our a$$ess blown out, and it's famous for this

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it is amazing how beat down we are that we take solace in 'almost getting there'#BravesDisorder

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 10:44 am 
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Get off my lawn!


Meh, I choose to look at it like "it could be worse". At least there is light at the end of the tunnel (I think :lol: )


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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 10:59 am 
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AngryJohnny51 wrote:
Get off my lawn!


Meh, I choose to look at it like "it could be worse". At least there is light at the end of the tunnel (I think :lol: )



oh, you poor deluded man. could be worse=Panther Superbowl Win...

honestly, who do you think has a better shot in the next 2 years?

then we would be the ONLY NFC South team without a ring.

it's waaaay past time to 'trend us into a Superbowl', but I keep forgetting :whistle:

it's a 'process'. a 3,5,7,9 year 'process'. we have moved past 'explosive' and this year were getting 'tougher' and lucky us, we now have 'productive vulernability!' :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 12:44 pm 
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Quote:
honestly, who do you think has a better shot in the next 2 years?


Probably neither. Panthers will come back down to earth this year.

Quote:
then we would be the ONLY NFC South team without a ring.

it's waaaay past time to 'trend us into a Superbowl', but I keep forgetting :whistle:

it's a 'process'. a 3,5,7,9 year 'process'. we have moved past 'explosive' and this year were getting 'tougher' and lucky us, we now have 'productive vulernability!' :lol:


A Super Bowl win would be great. I get it. That is the ultimate goal of every franchise. But obviously it ain't that easy. You have to make the playoffs to win a Super Bowl. for that you need to have a good quality team year in and year out. I think we are seeing that here now. (recently). Would you rather compete every year, or just be a one year wonder and then have the franchise fall back to obscurity? Like I said, a Super Bowl is the goal, but it is nice to at least have a competitive team year in and year out as well instead of s***. Complacent? Nope. Just happy knowing that we have a shot at the playoffs which means we have a shot at the big enchilada.


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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 4:52 pm 
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I don't think we have a shot at the playoffs this year; but I'm hoping like you that we could get a consistently good team. Anytime we start playing good all these folks including Blank; start talking playoffs and Super Bowl;
before we're ready to get there.

At this point I don't think we've earned the right to say playoffs. We were 4-12 last year, we did have a lot of injuries; but I also feel we've played many a season without the normal amount of injuries. As soon as we lose one person this year everybody gonna scream " the injuries again" when its a part of the game.

Now I look at each season one season at a time..... The difference between winning 10 and losing six, is so much more fun, its just hard for me to get my head around why we can't do it more often?

I certainly didn't think the Smith's tried either, but I won't forget our one Super Bowl was under the Smiths?? Would you rather compete every year, or just be a one year wonder and then have the franchise fall back to obscurity?

No I just get mad at our organization from time to time, but really last year before the injuries we went into the season without offensive or defensive linemen!! Now that's just stupid!!

I honestly don't think except with our first draft pick we've done a lot to help ourselves; but also why I think 8-8 is probable or even 9-7 possible??

My main fear is Blank will fire Thomas D. AND Coach Smith and he won't know who to hire.......All of his coaching hires has wanted out soon, so something is wrong inside the organization IMO, I figure its working with Blank that Thomas D. and Coach Smith just ignore.

So why I say they'll never win again is I'm afraid Blank will fire them both next year and his past before them has been horrible with Coaches.

As frustrated as I've been with Thomas D. I want him to have tasted this only winning 4 games; and hopefully he's made some changes we don't really notice and we do well this season.......

Early with Thomas D. & Coach Smith I also believed this was the tandem that would bring us good consistent football. I still believe we have a better chance with them because Blank likes them, and Really during their time here they've done pretty well.

If they could win 9 next year and not get fired, I'd get jazzed up again for the Falcons. My frustration is we did what you don't want to ever see;
we went from good to 4-12, in such a short time.

I think its critical for this franchise to have a good record this year; firing everyone will bring more confusion again to the franchise and we
can't handle that again.....

So to make my final statement I do believe the Falcons could be good again but it will only happen under Thomas D. & Coach Smith. My fear is they don't have the personnel to do that; and if Blank fires them then yes I don't think we see the Falcons winning much again..... Most won't understand why I feel this way; but Angry, you've seen what most coaching changes are like so 9-7 needs to keep our Gm and Coach!!

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 5:01 pm 
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AngryJohnny51wrote:
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" Despite popular belief, the franchise has come along ways....


Yes and 85% of that is from Thomas D. and Coach Smith!!

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 6:18 pm 
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[quote="AngryJohnny51Would you rather compete every year, or just be a one year wonder and then have the franchise fall back to obscurity?.[/quote]


remind me of that every time I go to a Saints game at the Dome :doh:

your kidding, right? I'd rather have one ring and be out of it for 5 years, rather then have 4 playoff appearances and get shown the door...same holds true for ALL of the NFC South.

It's like the Braves. Win one, and then I will feel a little better about getting shut down in the playoffs every year. For 10-14 years.

It's like a Cubs fan proclaiming 'hey, at least we made the playoffs'. beaten wife, or Stockholm syndrome? For chrissakes, it's not like we are the Browns or the Raiders, but c'mon.

first we needed to make the playoffs.

check

then we needed to kill the 'back to back'

check

then we needed a playoff 'win'

5 attempts. we finally DID that.

so now, were supposed to be 'okay' with 'competing'?

like that stupid Washington game last year?

what are we in now, year 8? 8 years in? of a 'five year process' of 'explosive' 'tough' play?

Look, I get it...I have nothing but respect, and I mean big ball respect for Browns, Cubs, Pirates, Raiders fans...I know we could have it 'much worse'.

And I want, really want to desperately 'buy in' and get on the train...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vx5n21zHPm8

and I know your moniker denotes 'grumpy'..But I guess after watching the '10 yards from the Superbowl' game with that pit in my stomach..heeere it comes...
like the Braves 2 years ago with the 'infield fly rule'. And now the Braves have personally screwed my 'hood, and the Falcons are bending us over..I guess it makes me more cynical.

I don't think we have even a prayer of winning the division...and even in 2011-12 I did not feel that way.

I appreciate you being the calm voice amidst the rubble. I learned from Pudge last season to disregard my predeliction to obsess about 'injuries'..Hell, the fact that Ryan stayed alive has proven me wrong. And maybe, you are right.

look, if we go to the playoffs this season, and lose 'again'...are you honestly going to tell me that you are going to be 'okay' with that? Is that 'progress'? I don't think we have a legit shot at the playoffs this year..But if we made it and lost *again* are you, me and Blank gonna be satisfied? No sir.

the story is going the 'here they go again' , not 'look what these guys have done with less' (see Braves)

Im with Pudge. I think were going to go through another 2-3 year transition.

I hope Im wrong :ninja:

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 6:36 pm 
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It's like the Braves. Win one, and then I will feel a little better about getting shut down in the playoffs every year. For 10-14 years.


No the Braves made the World Series a lot, their were a very respected franchise that did win one "WORLD SERIES," but were always expected to be good. You could be proud of the Braves Franchise; now look at them,
nobody expects crap from them even if they do well!! Before that they were complete losers!!

Baseball is so different from football, getting to a lot of world series is exciting; it was a blessing we won one to keep out terrible discussions.

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 8:22 pm 
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fun gus wrote:
I learned from Pudge last season to disregard my predeliction to obsess about 'injuries'..Hell, the fact that Ryan stayed alive has proven me wrong.

:lol:

Wait until Ryan gets hurt this season...

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 6:19 pm 
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look, if we go to the playoffs this season, and lose 'again'...are you honestly going to tell me that you are going to be 'okay' with that? Is that 'progress'? I don't think we have a legit shot at the playoffs this year..But if we made it and lost *again* are you, me and Blank gonna be satisfied? No sir.


If you don't think we have a shot at the playoffs this year, but we make it;
how can you not be satisfied?? Do you want to stay a 4 win team or would 10 wins make a better impression?? You sound mad about the past; and trust me that can't be changed!!

Now I don't care what Blank thinks but making the playoffs would probably have us winning 10 games, 6 more than last year and setting us up for better things to come. Its just been lately that we've lost most playoff games...... Their was a time when we got in maybe 2 out of 3 years in the 80s and won a couple of playoff games.

Yes making the playoffs is big progress, something I don't expect!!

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 11:10 am 
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Cyril wrote:
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look, if we go to the playoffs this season, and lose 'again'...are you honestly going to tell me that you are going to be 'okay' with that? Is that 'progress'? I don't think we have a legit shot at the playoffs this year..But if we made it and lost *again* are you, me and Blank gonna be satisfied? No sir.


If you don't think we have a shot at the playoffs this year, but we make it;
how can you not be satisfied?? Do you want to stay a 4 win team or would 10 wins make a better impression?? You sound mad about the past; and trust me that can't be changed!!!!



You made my point for me. The rest of the NFC South plays for the big prize, which is why we are 'content' just 'making it' to the playoffs. It's why the Saints and the Buccs have a ring and we don't. It's why the one time the Panthers made it, they made a game of it, and we did not.

But Blank has said: repeatedly and in public: just making it to the playoffs and losing *again* is not acceptable for him. So don't be mad when Smitty/Td get's shown the door after 8-9 years, no matter how 'bad' we were. or how 'good' they are.

If we actually make it to the playoffs and get smoked again, I gay ron tee Blank will lose his sh*t. :snooty:

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 1:10 am 
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Gus,
I'd need proof the rest of the NFC South aims for Super bowls....Sure they want to play good; but like the Falcons, I don't think any of the 3 other teams can go to a Super Bowl, and deep down neither do they.

Players have to act like something big is coming to try to generate fans,
and even keep themselves excited!!

Look when you only win 4 games despite injuries, and I was calling for only 6 wins last year, now that's sucking..... The Falcons suck, I've said it more than I want to on a Falcon sight, but hell injures didn't cost us 12 games last year; and we've been horrible most of our history.

Its the same for about 13 teams and that's a lot of cities. When you've NEVER won a Super Bowl you can't really believe they think this year will change everything!! 4 teams have never been to a Super Bowl.

As of the end of the 2013-14 season, 13 NFL teams have never won a Super Bowl.

There are 9 teams that have been to the Super Bowl (in years shown) and lost each time:

Minnesota Vikings (0-4) 1970, 1974, 1975, 1977
Buffalo Bills (0-4) consecutively 1991-1994
Cincinnati Bengals (0-2) 1982, 1989
Philadelphia Eagles (0-2) 1981, 2005
San Diego Chargers (0-1) 1995
Atlanta Falcons (0-1) 1999
Tennessee Titans (0-1) 2000
Carolina Panthers (0-1) 2004
Arizona Cardinals (0-1) 2009

There are 4 Teams that have never played in a Super Bowl:

Cleveland Browns
Detroit Lions
Houston Texans
Jacksonville Jaguars

So do you really think any of these 13 teams are aiming for a Super Bowl? Please tell me which ones?? I mean you can point to something but that doesn't mean you believe it!!

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 7:37 am 
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I'll close with this. You make very solid points, Cyril.

I have a friend who is an ardent Saints fan, and we discussed this at length..The Saints were terrible for sooo long, their fans wore paper bags,and nobody ever believed they would ever win a SB. They don't feel that way anymore. They brought home a Lombardi, and they can go back to sucking for 25 years, those fans down there will still be happy, just because they can think back to winning that one prize.

Similarly, the Braves are perennial choke-artists, but, I can forgive them a lot because they brought this city it's only Championship. Had they never won in 95, and had a history of getting to the WS and never closing the deal, I would feel the same way about them as I do about the Falcons. But, they didn't choke. Even though the Braves went right back to choking again, for one year we were relevant. Yankees fans that used to taunt us 'where's your rings'? That stopped in 1995. Every Saints game here is a nightmare,because they can now say 'at least when we got there, we did not suck'we were winners.once"

I know it could be worse. I don't know what it's like being a Jags fan or a Lions fan..I can imagine it's not good..I know that many would 'rather' be competitive year after year and never win the prize, and I can respect that, I guess but for me, win just once: and you can go back to choking again. Just win one time.

I guess Im just weird that way :whistle:

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 9:44 am 
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Quote:
but for me, win just once: and you can go back to choking again. Just win one time.


That's your opinion (and I'm sure you are not alone) and I respect it. After 40 years of sucking, win one Super Bowl and then go back to another 25 years of sucking?.....hmmm. I think I would rather trade that one Lombardi and be competitive (and by that I mean in the playoffs) year in and year out. Once you're in, anything can happen. Maybe I'm the weird one.


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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 1:06 pm 
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I've always had the belief that once the playoffs start, it doesn't matter whether you are 13-3 or 9-7. The hot team, with some luck on their side, will probably walk out with the Lombardi.
We've seen it time and time again, and so my way of looking at it differs: Get to the playoffs. Don't even think of the Superbowl until then.

Although I'm much more on Johnny's side, I'd rather win a Superbowl and NOT go back to sucking. You don't go back to sucking by having a good owner who makes good hiring decisions, which I believe we have after a few turbulent tries...

We will win a Superbowl one day. Luckily I'm still young enough that regardless if its in this era or not, I'll probably see it. I'd prefer that we stay competitive in the meantime and have something to look forward to every season and offseason, even if it does end in eventual heartbreak.

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:44 pm 
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Gus your not weird.... If the Falcons would have won their Super Bowl instead of Eugene " getting caught " on the night before the Super Bowl,
I think we'd all feel better about this franchise.

Since I think I know fairly close the talent on this franchise, I feel I can only
hope we get better asap then be good enough to hope Super Bowl.....

The Saints on the other hand may have the best coach in football today and a Qb that has proven he can win a Super Bowl and I personally believe an underrated Qb, who may still become an all time great....

The Saints OWNER has just made much better decisions than ours in the
last ten years.

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 10:06 pm 
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It's an interesting proposition and dilemma. On one hand, being able to go to the games (or watch them) and see a team that wins 5 out of 6 years and makes the playoffs 4 out of 6 years is a very good thing. If that team doesn't win, then that's a decent consolation prize.

But the problem becomes if over the course of 5 or so years, you don't win, then it's easy to blame the coach and/or GM. BUt what happens if that extends over 8 or 9 years? Then it stops being about the coach and about the QB.

Over the past 35 years, the most career playoff appearances a QB has made without starting in a Super Bowl is 14, shared by Danny White and Mark Brunell. Interestingly enough, both would be backups on Super-Bowl winning teams, White with the '78 Cowboys and Brunell with the '09 Saints.

Frankly, any QB in that time period that has started 8 or more playoff games has made at least 1 Super Bowl appearance as a starting QB over their career. The exceptions are guys like White, Brunell, Bernie Kosar, Warren Moon, Dave Krieg, and Philip Rivers. There may be a few others, but there's about 35 guys that have made 8 or more starts and pretty much 80-90% of have at least played/started in 1 Super Bowl.

Matt Ryan is at 5 playoff appearances. If the Falcons manage to make the playoffs in 2 out of the next 3 years and they don't go to at least 1 Super Bowl, the murmurs about Matt Ryan can't win the big game will begin anew and frankly, unlike the last time when it was about winning a playoff game, winning a Super Bowl is a lot harder.

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 1:16 pm 
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Pudge Wrote:
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Matt Ryan is at 5 playoff appearances. If the Falcons manage to make the playoffs in 2 out of the next 3 years and they don't go to at least 1 Super Bowl, the murmurs about Matt Ryan can't win the big game will begin anew and frankly, unlike the last time when it was about winning a playoff game, winning a Super Bowl is a lot harder


IMO Matt Ryan can't carry a team to a Super Bowl, so unless everything is
set up around him we won't win. Its not that he can't win a big game; its that he can't win a big game without much better defenses; and better lines and a running game. The longer he plays the more rookies come in that push him further down the ladder.

I won't look it up but my guess is his playoff games have far more turnovers than his regular season games. 1 more turnover a game is a lot; like a snap that hits him in the knee and is recovered by opponents.

As Andrew Luck and and Cam Newton progress Ryan will fall further down the list and won't be a top 10 Qb. It won't be Ryan's fault, some younger Qbs are just better; Guys like RG3, and Frisco's Qb should get better and they move the chains too.

Guys who want to blame the coaches; and guys like me who blame the line soon will have to accept Ryan's shortcomings. He's been consistently above average, and a little less as the defenses get better in playoffs!!

I really think we've fooled ourselves if we think Ryan can take us anywhere without a lot of help. No, I don't hate him, he's good; just not good enough or as good as his best competition!!


Its still about Ryan winning playoff games. 1 out of 5 is not good,

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 2:43 pm 
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I really think we've fooled ourselves if we think Ryan can take us anywhere without a lot of help. No, I don't hate him, he's good; just not good enough or as good as his best competition


I hear some people say Peyton Manning is the best in the game and quite possibly the best to ever play. Fact: He has always had talented receivers and a really good offensive line protecting him. Why hasn't he won more in the playoffs? He is 11-12, yes a losing record. The answer is he still doesn't have the players around him. (Defensively) So I don't wanna hear Matt Ryan can't carry a team without people around him if the so called greatest to ever play can't do it either.


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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 6:14 pm 
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Cyril wrote:
Pudge Wrote:
Quote:
Matt Ryan is at 5 playoff appearances. If the Falcons manage to make the playoffs in 2 out of the next 3 years and they don't go to at least 1 Super Bowl, the murmurs about Matt Ryan can't win the big game will begin anew and frankly, unlike the last time when it was about winning a playoff game, winning a Super Bowl is a lot harder


IMO Matt Ryan can't carry a team to a Super Bowl, so unless everything is
set up around him we won't win. Its not that he can't win a big game; its that he can't win a big game without much better defenses; and better lines and a running game. The longer he plays the more rookies come in that push him further down the ladder.

I won't look it up but my guess is his playoff games have far more turnovers than his regular season games. 1 more turnover a game is a lot; like a snap that hits him in the knee and is recovered by opponents.

As Andrew Luck and and Cam Newton progress Ryan will fall further down the list and won't be a top 10 Qb. It won't be Ryan's fault, some younger Qbs are just better; Guys like RG3, and Frisco's Qb should get better and they move the chains too.

Guys who want to blame the coaches; and guys like me who blame the line soon will have to accept Ryan's shortcomings. He's been consistently above average, and a little less as the defenses get better in playoffs!!

I really think we've fooled ourselves if we think Ryan can take us anywhere without a lot of help. No, I don't hate him, he's good; just not good enough or as good as his best competition!!


Its still about Ryan winning playoff games. 1 out of 5 is not good,



I've been disappointed in Ryan in the postseason. I guess, though, it pays to look at how a QB would best shine.

Ryan is a cerebral QB, the kind that benefits from 5 legit (not great) pass catchers in patterns, so he can identify mismatches and get rid of the ball.

We've yet to have that. Brady had it most of the time, Brees almost all the time, Peyton almost all the time, and with good OLs. I have doubts about how good Ryan can be, but I know we'll never find out in an offense that isn't about creating mismatches and letting the QB identify and exploit them.

Get a tall burner, and a wide catch radius possession receiver, and a TE who can catch (all 3rd to 4th round guys) and you'll see a way better offense...and the kind the Saints, Pack, New England, and Peyton's team have aimed to put together yearly. Stars and scrubs isn't the way to go.

That said, Ryan was very very good even with mistakes his last postseason, so maybe he's gotten over the hump.

I still would guess, give him an average+ OL, and average+ run game, and average+3-6 receiving options, and he'll look very good. That's not needing a "ton." That's needing to be average to above average across your offense...not top 5. All QBs need that.


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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:36 pm 
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My personal opinion is that Ryan probably isn't good enough to put this team on his back and carry them to a Super Bowl. He got close in 2012, but that was again probably his peak season. From a historical perspective, there's absolutely no reason to think he has another season like that ever again. Maybe he has a late career resurgence like Kurt Warner, Peyton Manning, and Brett Favre did…but how many coaching staffs and/or teams did they have to move to and through to get there?

I agree with the others that he needs more help. A LOT more help. The problem is that this front office has not shown they are adept at giving it to him.

And the coaching staff doesn't help because they themselves are just as mediocre.

A year ago, I thought Dimitroff was the only weak link in the Triumvirate. He was Crassus, while Smitty & Ryan were Pompey & Caesar, respectively. Now I feel like it's Larry, Curly and Moe.

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:31 am 
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Angry Wrote
Quote:
" "I hear some people say Peyton Manning is the best in the game and quite possibly the best to ever play. Fact: He has always had talented receivers and a really good offensive line protecting him. Why hasn't he won more in the playoffs? He is 11-12, yes a losing record. The answer is he still doesn't have the players around him. (Defensively) So I don't wanna hear Matt Ryan can't carry a team without people around him"


Sorry but he can't. In our entire existence we've only played 15 playoff games while Manning has lead his teams to 23 playoff games and won a
Super Bowl, in only his playing days; not like our franchise 's total existence!!

Ps. Matt is 1-4. That's why he does better during the season; the playoffs are just harder to get to, then win!!

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 Post subject: Re: Falcons and their history
PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2014 9:01 pm 
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Cyril wrote:
Ps. Matt is 1-4. That's why he does better during the season; the playoffs are just harder to get to, then win!!

Especially when you're at best an average team in most phases of the game.

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